My 2020 Betting P&L

I'm always a little apprehensive about publishing stuff like this because those handsome well-rounded individuals, the keyboard warriors, cannot wait to pounce on such things. However, I also think it's important to 'walk the talk', which is why I regularly share my betting P&L.

What follows in the video below is an account of the withdrawals from and deposits to my bank account in 2020. Before you look at that, though, a few important points:

  1. Plenty bet more than me, many bet less than me. So what?! This is not about absolute figures, it's about the art of the possible, and how fun and profit (whatever that figure looks like for you - after all, getting paid pennies for having fun is a great outcome) are not mutually exclusive.
  2. I'm not sharing this to show off personally but, rather, to show off Geegeez Gold, which of course I use almost exclusively (along with odds comparison data).
  3. This is not turnover, which was much higher. Funds in accounts frequently get played multiple times before withdrawals are made.
  4. There were two months in 2020 when I didn't have a bet (one desperate Hong Kong placepot lunge aside!) - those two months may have been good or bad for the bottom line, who knows?
  5. In absolute terms, this was my best betting year ever; but part of that was a function of (slightly) higher staking in favourable markets. Those favourable markets were generally pari-mutuel pools.
  6. I have LOTS of accounts, plenty of them now useless, and I use all of the ones where I can still bet more than £5! Taking 3/1 when 7/2 is available to you is just stupid if your bottom line is a key consideration: don't do it.
  7. I had plenty of small losing accounts in 2020, as well as a couple of big winning ones; that's a function of how I bet.
  8. Honestly, I have no idea what my turnover was - I'd guess in the region of £100,000. So that's a very solid 10% ROI, which is double what I'd generally aspire to.
  9. These figures are not life-changing, but to ultimately get paid a bit for having a hell of a lot of fun is outlook-changing. I bought shares in racehorses in lieu of being able to go away! 🙂
  10. In the interests of transparency, I should add that, as a syndicate captain on Colossus, I am entitled to a 10% rebate on syndicate bets. I can fund those bets to no more than 50% myself and almost always take the maximum 50% allowance: I am betting for me first, and others may hitch a ride if/when it suits. Those rebates accounted for just shy of £2,000 in 2020, so feel free to deduct that from the on-screen totals.
  11. I expect 2021 will be tougher - last year was a positive outlier - but I'll be happy for £2,000-£4,000 if I can get it, on similar turnover.
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Here follows a video of me downloading 2020's bank transactions and editing them live for betting entries. The more curious among you will note how much of my disposable goes on food, booze, coffee and travel (even in a 'no travel' year) !

10 Things You Didn't Know about Geegeez Racecards

Good luck!

Matt

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37 replies
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Cheers Graham. 10% is a very good result, and anyone who does that – whether it means £100 or £100,000 – is doing very well!

      Reply
  1. Tom
    Tom says:

    Matt, very refreshing to see someone hold themselves accountable, it’s such a great way to improve and actually deliver! Hats off to you.

    My initial comment when I first looked at the graph was “ok, so what can be learned from June to October?”, but then had a little think to myself and thought, “well it probably something to do with form not potentially being true, as we were just starting out after lockdown”.

    I must say, 10% ROI is a really good result. Better than the money being sat in a bank at 0.5% (or less!)

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi Tom

      Regarding “what can be learned from the losing run”, the key learning is that people have losing runs, especially those who, like me, chase bigger-odds payouts!

      In short, there’s nothing to learn except to know it WILL happen and to be resourced accordingly.

      Matt

      Reply
  2. Mark H
    Mark H says:

    Brilliant Results Matt Well Done,

    One question how do you keep so many accounts open, i have B365, Skybet, William Hills, plus BF Exchange; everyone else shut me down years ago.

    Krs,

    Mark

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Thanks Mark.

      I have loads of closed accounts, including some you can see in the images.
      I have zero secrets on keeping accounts open.
      Most of my betting is not done with traditional bookmakers these days, though that could change at any time as I have a (likely unhealthy) dependence on one currently.

      Matt

      Reply
  3. rolldeeptips101
    rolldeeptips101 says:

    First off, well done.

    Secondly, that circa £3,000 drawdown from June to October- that’s what separates the men from the boys, being able to swallow that sort of a drawdown and carry on. Then you saw profit after that. I know myself from betting on horses what a losing run CAN do to you psychologically, although mentality can be improved upon and you just have to accept losses are part of it. You absolutely must be able to lose in order to win at betting on horses.

    That graph is very typical of horse racing: a very good start, some levelling off, long long losing period followed by an upturn in fortunes. Just proves it can be done, although you are possibly an exception rather than the rule in terms of racing punters.

    You can’t time when your good runs or bad runs are going to happen, and they’ll be different for everybody. June 2020 was possibly my best ever month but for you it was a losing month. Everyone is different.

    It’s not massive money but any profit should absolutely be applauded as we have to remember we are playing a largely rigged game, so to come out on top you should be proud of it, and show it off, why not? Anyone who can’t stomach somebody else winning doesn’t deserve to win themselves (and they will probably never win!)

    congratulations, Matthew. All tax-free as well. That’s enough d*ck-sucking from me

    Reply
    • rolldeeptips101
      rolldeeptips101 says:

      The forensic detailing of you going into your accounts was a bit unnecessary, though, but I guess it gives the cynics and doubters no rope whatsoever

      Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Some really good points there, rolldeep.

      The way I bet – very often chasing big prices and big pots – has to be done with a mindset and bankroll that supports it.
      I’m under no illusions that long losing runs are a function of my play style, and I’m set up accordingly.

      I’ve spoken about this at length – including in this: https://www.geegeez.co.uk/2020-vision-some-thoughts-on-betting-better/ (which also includes last year’s P/L figures)

      For people who want to have more fun by engaging slightly more seriously with racing and betting, the groundwork is pivotal.
      Knowing the art of the possible, knowing the implications of betting at average odds of x or y, dealing with the downside of that in a reasonably stoic manner… they’re all key assets.

      No booms, no tears. Just good times and bad times within the temperate tropics of emotional latitude. If you catch my drift. 🙂

      Matt

      Reply
  4. Jodami93
    Jodami93 says:

    What a great time-saving way to do the accounts! I will definitely give that try. I know you have said that you increased your stake on the pari-mutuel pools but do you think there were any other reasons why 2020 was such a good year? Would you say you were focusing on different races for example or using newer insights more such as pace and time?

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi Darren

      No, I wasn’t focusing on anything differently especially; maybe slightly more focus on pool betting; and perhaps a slight natural improvement in selection technique. But nothing more than time-served experience I don’t think.

      A calendar year is an arbitrary chunk of time, of course, so it might go deep down south for a bit now – who knows? It’ll still be enjoyable to some degree, even in that context.

      Matt

      Reply
  5. Monsieurbernie
    Monsieurbernie says:

    interesting, always good to know how others do.

    i keep a record of my profit and loss each month and did the totals like yourself..
    my turnover for 12 months was £129k… profit was £7907 from that, would have been better but for losing nearly £5k in december 🙁 my ROI -6.13%

    so cant complain if making money, 3 years in a row now since i started recording my bets.

    obviously this is not enough to make a living from it, i have a full time job but its a nice top up… what would you say is a good ROI? i always wonder am i doing ok?!

    i also do wonder if its all worth it, i do spend most of my spare time studying form and watching racing which can impact on other parts of life. horse racing is certainly my passion though.

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      What is a good ROI? Is it all worth it?

      If your focus is on the first one, it’s probably not all worth it.

      If the time you put in is not at least generally pleasurable, then you can get a low-paying extra job to replace the levels of profit you and I are enjoying.

      The point – and sorry for labouring it – is that it HAS to be fun. For me anyway.

      Matt

      Reply
      • Monsieurbernie
        Monsieurbernie says:

        ha the thought of an extra job over doing the horses , no thanks!

        looking forward to kempton park later this afternoon, so i do enjoy it and look forward to getting stuck into the cards.

        they may come a time when i cant put the hours in though, which in turn i would suspect profits would dip as i wouldnt be putting the hours in required.. for now i can so will continue to do so.. hope for another profit in 2021… up so far n jan!

        Reply
  6. acranea
    acranea says:

    Fascinating stuff in many ways.

    Main takeaways…you spend too much at Tescos :-D…& how in the name of god do you still get on at Betway?

    “Read the screen” the ad says. When I do that all it says is “you are restricted to 45p E/W”

    2nd worst bookie in the UK (after Mansionbet, whom I never expect to be challenged for top spot)

    Reply
  7. bigvern63
    bigvern63 says:

    Hi Matt

    Appreciate the transparency and I would love a ROI of 10%, probably take anything that was positive to be honest!! Did a not dissimilar exercise on my Bet365 account for net deposits over the last 4 calendar years and comes out at a cost of around £50 per week, not too bad for a very enjoyable hobby and certainly improved in recent years by joining the geegeez site.

    A couple of quick questions:

    – Were the bet free months when we were in the initial lockdown?
    – A decent slice of your profit was made in the first couple of months of the year, any particular reasons for that?

    All the best, Chris

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi Chris

      I think reconciling that an acceptable loss is fair payment for many hours of engagement is the first step to ‘enlightenment’ (in this very broad sense). That it can be improved upon, to break even and then to profit, are the next.

      On your questions, yes no bet during lockdown – nothing that interested me to bet on, so no bet. I’m compelled to back my opinion on racing and, to a lesser degree (and with far less statistical regimen), football; very little else.

      No real reason the profit was early in the year; just how the cards fell.

      Matt

      Reply
  8. Denis mc grath
    Denis mc grath says:

    Hi Matt first and foremost using a spread sheet is an absolute must and probably the most important tool to have in your Tool Box if you don’t buy into this and implement it you are not serious about your Craft continued success Regards Denis

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi Denis

      We also have a Bet Tracker on geegeez: though it doesn’t include all bet types, it’s useful for most punters.

      Agree with tracking profit and loss, at least to some level of understanding, being crucial.

      Matt

      Reply
      • RoosterCogburn
        RoosterCogburn says:

        Hi Matt,

        On this subject is there any plans to allow free text to the Bet Tracker so we could include pool bets ?

        Reply
        • Matt Bisogno
          Matt Bisogno says:

          Hi Rooster

          No immediate plans, though it might be something we look at down the line.

          For now, the workaround might be to use the comments field with such as ‘Win 6’ or ‘Jackpot’ along with the pool provider; and to select the closest cumulative odds from the dropdown.

          Example: £25 staked, £430 returned, would be 16/1 as near as doesn’t matter.

          Appreciate that’s imperfect, but hope it helps as a suggestion.
          Matt

          Reply
  9. bigvern63
    bigvern63 says:

    Thanks Matt

    I adopt a fairly scattergun approach, sometimes multiple runners in bigger races and like a patent or Lucky 15. I have had a couple of decent four figure payouts, but inevitably more losers than winners. If I had the time, I am sure I could refine my betting strategy, but for now, it is a hobby rather than anything more serious.

    Reference the start of your betting year in 2020, I was just curious if the profit came from a different sport and/or a couple of healthy winners but sounds like you hit a good run over that period.

    Keep up the good work, love the site.

    All the best, Chris

    Reply
  10. John Farrell
    John Farrell says:

    Didn’t mean a lot to me this!! A lot of clicking on a very lopsided (date wise ) spreadsheet
    I don’t doubt any credibility of either matt or his team
    Would love to net 10 grand a year though!!

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi John

      Lopsided date wise because it wasn’t sorted by date! 😀

      [Was sorted by transaction amount]

      Matt

      Reply
  11. mgp3011
    mgp3011 says:

    Hi Matt, interesting stuff… I’m in the industry, having worked for certainly the two biggest in the UK. For me it’s about value bets, 5/1 or more.. my question, do you place on the nose or ew? Speak to trader and they would say on the nose, however I think the enjoyment is somewhat curtailed by deeper losing runs and tend to back ew… what are your views on this?

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi mgp

      I’ve always said that it very much depends on personality: win only is generally a better way to go profit-wise (though if you can avail of each-way concessions, it is not necessarily the best). But each-way is definitely better mentally and keeps us in the game longer. Personally, I do a mix of both and without too much science attached to it!

      Matt

      Reply
  12. Ian
    Ian says:

    Hi Matt,

    Impressive returns, when you consider the bookies/pool margins. I would applaud anyone who breaks even against a bookies overround.

    Following a successful Cheltenham in 2016 (Ivanovich Gorbatov how did that win looking at it now) I opened a separate current account purely for betting with some of the profits to increase transparency to myself as well as recording every punt on a spreadsheet and I’ve not had a “wages” bet since always maintaining that bank and an ROI 8%.

    It is a hobby and should be fun but with a bit of selection (several courses are now avoided completely) and discipline it becomes a one that pays for itself.

    Reply
  13. spiritrising85
    spiritrising85 says:

    Well done Matt a good profit for the year and good to see it can be done.

    Since coming up with an “in” to certain races based on historical data using the geez geez query tool I am looking at a 39% ROI over 2 months from 258 bets. If that manages to hold for another 12 months I will be very happy indeed and ill be back next year making my own video .

    The problem with gambling is no matter the data size we can never truly sure if the results will repeat for the next time period.

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      That’s great work, spiritrising, well done.

      One of my favourite things about racing is that the work is never done: we always have to be reinventing, assessing, evolving. And that’s great!

      Matt

      Reply
  14. wattyk14
    wattyk14 says:

    Matt, I love your openness. I must confess I didn’t understand a lot of your spread sheets but no worries Geegeez has been brilliant since I joined.
    A few questions.
    Could you please tell me what exactly are the types of bet you place on the pari mutuel and where do you place them.?
    What types of bets do you place with Colossus.?
    Which bookie are you referring to when you say you are using one a lot at present?
    I kept seeing the word ” Naked” . Is that one of those chat line thingies. (Only joking Matt)
    Keep up the good work and good luck for 2021.
    Keith Watson

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Hi Keith

      The profitable bets I place with Colossus are generally Win 6 (i.e. pick six winners).
      I also place lots of Place 6 (placepot) and a few footy bets there: these are probably losers overall but keep me entertained.

      Which is to say I could make more profit if I focused solely on that, but I bet for enjoyment, too, and am happy to erode the bottom line a bit to that end.

      Regarding Naked, no chat lines for me – honest, guv!
      It’s a wine company: that’d be my vice. They have some fantastic value offerings including a Ripasso which is superb at the price.

      Matt

      Reply
  15. Noisynoy
    Noisynoy says:

    Hi Matt, Your graph looks like everyone’s year, doesn’t it? Covid wrecked everything (even if by vague association) and thank heavens that we have the sport we love – even in the darkest hours our trainers, stable staff, jockeys and, of course, Geegeez have provided us with light relief from the worries about a bug that should never have seen the light of day and governments and scientists around the world who haven’t a clue about how to control this evil in our lives. That you made eight grand before lockdown (late March) speaks volumes for what you have achieved for each one of us who are privileged to be members of your “club”. As a “contrarian” I make more money in races where less is known about the horses (and therefore more needs to be known about their breeding, the trainers’ trends…easy with Geegeez! My graph looks like yours (although I had a brilliant December; yes, really!) but with smaller numbers. As a pensioner with responsibilities I can’t play with your sums of money but without Geegeez I would NOT be enjoying racing the way I now do. I wish you even more success in 2021 (bugs permitting!) and hope that you’ll be able to weather the latest “storm” which has been inflicted on us.

    Reply
    • Matt Bisogno
      Matt Bisogno says:

      Many thanks Richard for the kind words, but more than that for sharing your own experiences.

      As you know, contrarians are extremely welcome here! 🙂

      Keep well,
      Matt

      Reply

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